Category: Let's talk
I have been impressed by the people of The Ukraine.For the peaceful and courageous way they have protested about recent corrupt and rigged elections,NO shots have been fired,NO punches have been thrown in anger or disagreement these people have stood out in rain sub zero cold and snow without shelter proper food or heating to bring about change in their country and I for 1 wish them all the best.
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Its rare to see a protest in Eastern Europe without water cannons guns and death being involved..The world could learn so much from these commited and courageous people...
would the disillusioned brits and americans leave the comfort of their warm homes to stand out in protest if it would bring about an end to governmental corruption...Sadly the answer is a resounding No! Because we lack the courage of our convictions.
May I join with the honourable gentleman in his sentiments about the protesters in the Ukraine. however, I do have to say that once again it's comparing the incomparable. Whatever we think of our Labour government, and whatever scandal there may be, political machinations, call it what you like, the fact is that things are quite nice in america and britain thank you very much. The idea of voters having to go out and stand in the cold in our respective countries is therefore not really an issue, so whilst I agree that voters in this country wouldn't do what the Ukrainians have done in the past few days, I don't see how that implies that we don't have the courage of our convictions because, quite frankly, we don't need to fight to exercise our democratic will. nor do I agree that, in general, we in britain have lost the courage of our convictions as you seem to suggest above: take for instance the fuel protests in 2000, the anti-war marches of 2003, the Fathers for Justice protests of 2004, the protests against the anti-terrorism legislation conducted by groups such as Liberty, the protests conducted by the foxhunting lobby, the list goes on. All these protests, as well as many others, clearly demonstrate that, where a group of people in this country feel taht their rights are being ignored by the democratic processes we have in place, and where they feel that there is no other evenue, they protest for the very reason that they have the courage of their convictions. So yes, I'm sure voters would rather stay at home than stand outside parliament in the cold on polling day, but my point, Goblin, is this: first, the reason they don't is because the corruption you allege exists is in fact worlds apart from that faced in eastern Europe, and second, the fact that they don't does not mean that in this country we don't have the courage of our convictions. i look forward to your protesting on election day next year, with your blankets and paraffin stove to cook the soup, camped outside parliament or Downing street.
Well I'm glad to see Ive graduated to the hallowed halls of the Commons if Blunkett's job is available I certainly am.
LL.I would protest as would many others who feel this goverment has gone far enough in ignoring the rights and opinions of the British people.The farcical Deepcut Barracks "inquiry" is just one scandulous example of how shoddily we have been treated.Blair had a chance to save the Black Watch from the MOD axe but he declined to act I wonder if this was due to none of thet regiment's soldiers being killed lately,then we have Blunketts affair ok he's human and she is by all accounts, a very sexy lady, but the fact that he can act so immorally while pontificating to others in derisable.The FFj group a bunch of extremists and quite honestly its easy to see why the mothers don't want their children anywhere near these characters,FFJ has also been infiltrated by violent men who see it as a way to gain access to their traumatised and damaged children.We accept what happens in this country because we are too damned comfortable and insular to bother rocking our safe little boat!.
Dear oh dear the double standards of the poor fellow! He has a go at us for not protesting enough, but then he thinks we doth protest too much! Goblin all I can say is on the fathers for Justice issue, you don't know the law, and I do. I know the law and in a year's time will apply it every day, and believe me, these people have exhausted all other avenues. all right, there are some extremists just like in the loony leftist organisation Respect fronted by the man whom some might see as the enemy of the state George galloway, but these extremists are not representative as you jolly well know. As for david Blunkett I agree with you, but for completely different reasons as I think that in general a politician's private life is his own. Only if it is shown that blunkett's public judgment has been influenced should he resign. now, goblin, I long to see some consistency: post 1 laments the decline of the UK militant, whereas post 3 castigates the few militants we have. Do you want to know what I think? I think that your view is this: everyone should rise and protest against the ideas and policies that Goblin doesn't like, but the militants who don't fit in with the views which he supports are infantile timewasters or dangerous extremists.
Dear oh dear the double standards of the poor fellow! He has a go at us for not protesting enough, but then he thinks we doth protest too much! Goblin all I can say is on the fathers for Justice issue, you don't know the law, and I do. I know the law and in a year's time will apply it every day, and believe me, these people have exhausted all other avenues. all right, there are some extremists just like in the loony leftist organisation Respect fronted by the man whom some might see as the enemy of the state George galloway, but these extremists are not representative as you jolly well know. As for david Blunkett I agree with you, but for completely different reasons as I think that in general a politician's private life is his own. Only if it is shown that blunkett's public judgment has been influenced should he resign. now, goblin, I long to see some consistency: post 1 laments the decline of the UK militant, whereas post 3 castigates the few militants we have. Do you want to know what I think? I think that your view is this: everyone should rise and protest against the ideas and policies that Goblin doesn't like, but the militants who don't fit in with the views which he supports are infantile timewasters or dangerous extremists.
Dear oh dear the double standards of the poor fellow! He has a go at us for not protesting enough, but then he thinks we doth protest too much! Goblin all I can say is on the fathers for Justice issue, you don't know the law, and I do. I know the law and in a year's time will apply it every day, and believe me, these people have exhausted all other avenues. all right, there are some extremists just like in the loony leftist organisation Respect fronted by the man whom some might see as the enemy of the state George galloway, but these extremists are not representative as you jolly well know. As for david Blunkett I agree with you, but for completely different reasons as I think that in general a politician's private life is his own. Only if it is shown that blunkett's public judgment has been influenced should he resign. now, goblin, I long to see some consistency: post 1 laments the decline of the UK militant, whereas post 3 castigates the few militants we have. Do you want to know what I think? I think that your view is this: everyone should rise and protest against the ideas and policies that Goblin doesn't like, but the militants who don't fit in with the views which he supports are infantile timewasters or dangerous extremists.
Dearie Darie me, looks like LL, got a bit over excited and posted 3 times. :)
I still think someone in authority as high as Blunket is who has been proven to use his powers for his personal gain should consider resigning. Sure, his private life is his own but in using his influence as a minister to expediate something for his personal convenience he has thereby made his personal life relevant to his public figure. That's just my opinion of course, but I know if I used my bank's money to finance my married ex lover's condo, even if she repaid it a day later I would be fired on the spot. I just think the same morales apply. Yes, I could have an affair, say, and that would not affect my job, but the minute I started using my position at work to facilitate my affair the two have become intertwined and should be subject to an inquiry by my employer.
Cheers
-B
Now then my fine young lad I didn't get overexcited, I posted three times because the website got overexcited when it crashed and liked my information so much that it thought you should be treated to it three times. I think we're in basic agreement, for you outline the circumstances in which the fact that a politician's still got lead in his pencil has a bearing on his public position and should, as a consequence, force him to resign. Michael Howard is the only answer, vote Conservative!
I know the law and i will apply it! What utter arrogance from now on pal you and Wildebrew can entertain each other until your hearts are bleeding because I've had more than I can tolerate of your overbearing insulting attitude.
You won't be applying the law every day LL unless you work harder and spend less time pontificating on here about Michael bloody Howard! He hasn't got a cat's chance in hell of getting in and well you know it...Frey.
Goblin, I'd have to disagree with that actually.
If/when I disagree with you (which is by no means always mind you) I state my reasons for doing so and I am not claiming that there is no alternative view to mine, only that I'd be interested to see it backed up and sometimes I find comments out of hand and I post my opinions on that and why I have those opinions. I do not intend to insult those who I am disagreeing with (I always say what you say is .. or I disagree with .. not person x is an idiot). We have both agreed and disagreed on forums and you've brought up a different point of view, each ot his/her own so I really don't think you're taking that discussion the right way. I do appologize though if you feel I've insulted you personally for that has not been my intension. Discussion boards would be quite dull if no one had anythng to say and we didn't disagree.
Peace
-B
Pontificating? Overbearing? Insulting? Is it national adjective day or something? Or should I say, is it national present participles day? Well the wheels really have come off the Goblinwagon now haven't they? If you find the comment on here too hot to handle old lad, nobody's making you read it, are they? he's probably smoking at the nostrils with fury now and I haven't even got on to talking about the black Watch yet! But, of course, that's not for here. Freya, don't worry, I'm working hard enough to keep my head far enough above water to have achieved very competent in all my assessments so far, and even high very competent in two of them, so I'm heading in the right direction. As for Michael Howard, you see, even if the chances of the election win we all crave are slim according to the polls, at the very least to pontificate about him makes a Tory a lot more secure psychologically. And, of course, it always produces a pearl of ridicule from your good self, which is better than a debate where we all agree with each other. Vote Michael Howard!
And I see that since he's not posted to this discussion even though he has logged in, Goblin has decided to take my advice and get out of the kitchen as the heat's too intense.
Wildebrew this creature has consistantly ignored 2 messages i sent as he prefers to insult people in public does that stirke you as mature and reasonable.
If you choose to get in involved in this pathetic game that's your perogative but do not expect me to back you up as I have seen the real reason for LL's presence on this site.
Well that is rich coming from the world's expert on ignoring - Mr Gobby himself! If you have seen the real reason for LLs prescence on this site tell us all would you....And LL please don't imply that we all crave a victory for Michael at the next election, you know that's just more ridiculous Tory rubbish eh? Frey.
I wasn't aware that I implied we all crave a victory for Michael Howard, but all we tories do obviously! Anyway Freya I thought you were made of sterner stuff, even if I expressly stated that we all want a victory for Michael Howard you would quite rightly stick to your guns. Goblin if you've discovered the real reason for my presence on this site then do please tell me what it was, because when I joined there was no one reason for my doing so. There were several, and I'm not aware that any one of them predominated over the others. As for not responding to your messages, I thought I was going you a favour. I thought the last person you'd want email from was me.
Goblin.
I refuse to take sides or get involved in personal
disputes on this site, unless they concern acosha or myself. I'll back up where I feel my friend need help and are being completely trashed and not able to defend themselves, but on discussion differences and minor put downs I'd expect not to get involved, you can handle things quite well and I am not taking your or lawlord's side on any issue, I agree with him on many of the topics he's posted (not against you or explicitly against anyone, just in terms of the issues he brings up and his proposed stand on those issues), but also I have agreed with you on many postings of yours and I've disagreed as well. So, my only point was that I am not personally against anyone on this site and I avoid taking sides because I feel it's not worth it, being here is fun, disagreeing with people and agreeing with people and discussing things is fun but ultimately I feel it never gets to a point where something someone says about me here would really hurt me in real life, not unless it was a friend I had made through the web siet and met in person. :)
So, that being said, I hope we can continue communicating positively, over-all and that it is ok for us to disagree on some things and agree on others. Your contribution is valuable, it's often right, sometimes I disagree with it. :)
Either way, keep posting and everyone here, try not to get too personal, I think there is no need for it.
cheers
-bB
So you enjoy being spoken to as if you have the mental age of a 5yr old hmm strange hobby for a financial analyst,still each to his own.
Goblin this is the trouble, you fail to see the distinction between disagreement on a topic, and aspertions casted upon a person or people. i won't always agree with you, and I'm afraid I make no apology for that whatsoever. I have agreed with a fair number of your opinions, but others have failed to convince me, and I'm afraid that's life. wildebrew this is not a dispute as far as I'm concerned, this is a discussion about a topic that has nothing whatever to do with how a person is as a person. Many of my friends are completely and implacably opposed to me ppolitically or ideologically but we are nonetheless the best of friends. I don't seek to state untruths or insulting things about anyone on here, but nor do I seek the approval of anyone here either. If you don't approve of what I post, then it's your privilege not to read it. If I think that a post is distasteful, I say so; if I applaud the sentiments in a post, again, I say so. And, iimportantly, I always give reasons for my conclusions. I never get personal unless the things said about me are so serious as to merit the need to get personal, and I have no vendetta against anyone. It is not a question of taking sides: I don't ask anyone to take my side or not. I post a topic and invite people to disagree, or agree as the mood takes them. Surely I can't be expected to alter that.
Boglin
I can't stay I've had the questionable privellege of being address like a 5 year old by anyone on tis site yet, unless perhaps it were BlindGuy, I can't remember (not wanting to imagine what he would suggest doing to 5-year-olds mind you).
So, I'm not sure what to say on that point really.
LawLord, I did not imply you made a point of attacking people personally, I have not seen you do that, only sticking to your guns (opinions) when it comes to the discussion of a topic and taking the lawyers approach to it, which, I suppose, may not go down well with some people, each to his own really.
Anyways, I think this discussion is getting rather, well, personal, for everyone 's taste, let's stick to the issues.
cheers
-B
Boglin if you act like a 5 year old, then you get treated like one eh...?? Grow up and learn to take it when someone disagrees with you. Frey.
No Wildebrew I wasn't implying that you thought anything of that nature. It's only natural that I take a lawyers'sapproach to arguing, seeing as that's what I do for a living, or what I will do at least, and in any case, I don't see what is so difficult to stomach about constructing an argument correctly, reasoning to your conclusion and sticking to your guns. aFter all, if you didn't believe the views you were posting there wouldn't be much point posting them mi' old geezers. If people can't take the way other people post, then maybe the discussion arena is the wrong place for them.
Indeed LawLord, indeed. ;)
And amen to that.
Wildebrew I apologise as you know I'm far from tactful I was just really tired of the arrogant tone in this discussion,it was wrong of me to insult you and I'm sorry
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And what a crap world it would be if we all agreed.
Goblin :)
no offense taken mate. :)
Cheers pal.smile.
Ahhh i tell you man Irish pub's should be on prescription it's just a pleasure to sit there and drink a pint or 2.
Is the apology extended to Lawlord? Probably not, I'm probably still deficient in the manners set out above, but no apology was needed from my point of view as I bear no grudges, and at the end of the day, no discussion we have on here is personal.
The jury's still out I'm afraid pal.
The jury's still out I'm afraid pal.
Never mind. The jury's probably been wrongly directed in any case so their verdict will be unsound if they convict.